The Emerald City


something awesome

Posted in random by Scaramouche on 12 July, 2007

Okay, so I have these two friends. One of them is really “social activist”, and the other is… not. The social activist, Brendan, was ranting about the movie 300 (KICKASS) and saying he hated it because it was sexist, racist, and homophobic. I told this to my other friend, Justin, and he said, “Let me talk to him.” This is the resulting debate. I for one enjoyed it. Check it out.

JUSTIN: Hallo!

BRENDAN: I’m writing an essay for my upgrade course. =P

JUSTIN: That’s fantastic!

JUSTIN: What’s this about 300 being racist, sexist, and homophobic?

BRENDAN: I just ranted about it ^ ^

JUSTIN: Yes

JUSTIN: You do know 300 took place in a primitive time when people were savage and intolerance, right?

BRENDAN: Well, the sexist part was actually due to casting ^^

BRENDAN: I meant racist

JUSTIN: And that to gloss over that to appease you people who get your panties in a twist at the slightest hint of intolerance would be compromising historical accuracy? Which, yes, is much more important.

BRENDAN: Well, they could have NOT darkened Xerces’s skin quite so much. =P And they used black people to play as “Persians” for parts. I found out that the greeks were pretty well white at the time so there’s nothing to complain about there. Persians were Middle Eastern/Asian/White!

JUSTIN: Middle Eastern people had dark skin and that can be used as a stylistic choice to make one appear exotic or alien, which Xerses was, and also more sinister.

JUSTIN: Since all the men wore very little, they had to have a way of telling them apart

JUSTIN: And since skin was what was shown the most, it makes sense to define light and dark between the two sides.

BRENDAN: …Even though there was a lot of interbreeding between the two cultures. =P And they had a significant difference between garbs? That could have been good enough actually. The Spartans all wore red capes, golden shields, helmets, and nice loincloths that showed off their nice packages ^^ *coughs* Then the Persians had all other kinds of armour. =P

JUSTIN: But viewed from a distance, we don’t have time to pick out those differences. If you make the people themselves distinct, that’s not a problem.

JUSTIN: That way, the people who made the movie wouldn’t have to worry about making the armour too complicated or distinct. They could do whatever they liked.

BRENDAN: Did you see it already? ^^ Did you see the significant differences between armour?

JUSTIN: Nope

JUSTIN: But even if they were difference, it may not always have been like that

BRENDAN: Therefore, you can’t be the judge 🙂 The armour was very distinct.

JUSTIN: Concepts like that change a LOT in development

JUSTIN: I didn’t see any real differences.

JUSTIN: So, it’s not racist. Now, how is it sexist?

BRENDAN: Ladies aren’t portrayed well. They be SEX TOYS! Pfft… During the sex scene at the beginning, you see the wife writh in pleasure, but really don’t see anything of the guy. Camera angles. =P And then in Xerses’ tent, he had lots of female love slaves. That is objectional, but it doesn’t count as sexist. What REALLY irked me was the lesbian kissing. Uh, let’s see, that’s a new thing…

JUSTIN: Uhm… so?

BRENDAN: The whole, “ooooh, two women kisisng is hot” thing is fairly recent. =P

JUSTIN: Dude

JUSTIN: That’s the role women played back then

BRENDAN: It caters to the straight men and doesn’t portray women very well. They aren’t treated like human beings.

JUSTIN: That’s historical accuracy.

JUSTIN: Women weren’t even considered people in those times.

BRENDAN: There’s a difference. They can be sex slaves, fine, but it is historically inaccurate to have lesbian porn.

JUSTIN: What’s wrong with lesbians?

BRENDAN: The fact that they aren’t lesbians. They are fake lesbians who let men in but are called lesbians because straight men think it sounds hotter.

JUSTIN: Indians had their ‘two-spirited’ people, I’m sure it’s not completley unseemly for there to be Persian lesbians.

JUSTIN:  So… women kissing is bad if the girls aren’t exclusively attracted to other women?

BRENDAN: Yes, but it’s a specific device being used to rile up the straight men. Lesbian porn did not exist. =P It is not historically accurate. Sodomy of ANY kind was considered forbidden in the Western world. The Indians were the exception because they had their own cultures away from Europe and Asia. (Well, there’s a bit of gay in China and Japan… But that doesn’t count as it is not Persian)

JUSTIN: Sooo… appealing to the target demographic is a bad thing now?

JUSTIN: So long as it doesn’t appeal to YOU?

BRENDAN: It’s appalling when you are exploiting human beings and treating them as sexual objects. I actually felt sick after the initial *squeal* HOT GUYS! At Toronto Pride who were being used as advertising boards.

JUSTIN: But that’s not exclusive to 300, it’s called sex appeal, it’s EVERYWHERE.

BRENDAN: I know, and I object to it. -_-‘

JUSTIN: Plus, the women consented, so relax.

BRENDAN: I hate how sexualized our nation is. Bimbo with big breasts: Come buy this car for it lets you attract women *sighs and winks*

JUSTIN: I love it. Sex is great, free love is great, sex in society is great.

JUSTIN: You’re just being prudish

BRENDAN: There’s a difference. Sex in the name of love is beautiful. Sex in the name of making money is vile.

BRENDAN: I meant as in using the hormones of the people to attract it to products/services.

JUSTIN: …So? What’s wrong with appealing to someone’s senses to get them to buy something?

BRENDAN: It’s manipulative. People don’t think so clearly when the hormones are running through their minds. It makes them want the product even though it has nothing to do with the person who is selling it. It’s low and a dirty tactic.

BRENDAN: …Only makes sense if you’re selling whores.

JUSTIN: You must be really, REALLY stupid to fall for it, dude.

BRENDAN: That means that a large chunk of the population is stupid 🙂

BRENDAN: It works…

JUSTIN: Okay, the smiley faces? Irritating.

JUSTIN: And, yes, a large chunk of the population IS stupid and thinks with their collective penises

JUSTIN: or vaginas

BRENDAN: Or vaginas for the ladies.

BRENDAN: ^^;

BRENDAN: Yes

JUSTIN: So it’s now bad to want to make money?

BRENDAN: Still, it irritates me all the same. Sex to me is supposed to be beautiful and “holy” in a sense. But these companies defile the concept and make the right winged religious nuts go bonkers and prudish and make our societies prudish with their brainwashings.

BRENDAN: It’s bad to make money through manipulative means. ^^

JUSTIN: But… that’s how you make money. You manipulate people. Resumes are designed to manipulate people into making you look more competent than you are. You have to act appropriately to do the same.

JUSTIN: And sex is just sex. That’s it. It’s not holy.

BRENDAN: To me it is o-o;

JUSTIN: If it was so holy, then you wouldn’t be able to buy it for 10 dollars at street corners.

JUSTIN: And, well, as we’ve established, you’re not terribly bright
 
BRENDAN: Hence why it bugs me. I don’t like how society and everything has cheapened what I consider “holy”.

JUSTIN: Well boo-frikkity-hoo, welcome to the 21st century, holy be damned.

BRENDAN: I know. =P Whores have been around since the dawn of time. But still, I don’t like it. I just don’t act upon it besides in discussions. Whoring isn’t very nice for underaged peoples 😦

JUSTIN: So it’s not sexist, since women were sex slaves back then and lesbians are just Hollywood fodder. What is homophobic about the movie?

BRENDAN: Comment about the Athenians being “weak man lovers” when in history, it was the Athenians and their awsome gay squad who owned a lot of Persians.

JUSTIN: Yeah, but, propaganda is thrown aroudn all the time

JUSTIN: I’m sure Iraqis would call Americans weak to make themselves feel better. Hell, Americans are weak, mentally, some would argue.

BRENDAN: The Greeks tried to train gay people into warriors and had them in partners. They were fiercely protective of their man toys and their friends. Hence what made them effective ^^

BRENDAN: I still hate it. =P

JUSTIN: So… what? You hate it even though it ISN’T actually a homophobic thing to say and is just said to make them feel secure?

BRENDAN: The Spartans weren’t very nice to the Athenians that later SAVED THEIR HIENIES!

JUSTIN: The Spartans were being dicks. They were savage. That’s the point.

BRENDAN: *shrugs* I don’t like it all the same. I complain. A lot. I don’t like mean people 😦

JUSTIN: Well, complaining doesn’t make you smart, or right, or anything. You have called a movie racist, sexist, and homophobic based on little evidence and were shown to be wrong. So next time you want to make a stink about something, please, try to think about it before running your mouth off.

BRENDAN: I’m awful at phrasing things for one o_o; Perhaps my phrasing was incorrect, but there are people who are far more articulate. o_o;

JUSTIN: No, the entire basis for your argument was just retarded.

JUSTIN: Just… try to think these things through. Accusing a movie of being intolerant needs just a bit more evidence.
BRENDAN: …Although I do commend the queen for being awsome in the stabbing of the traitor 🙂

JUSTIN: Stabbing is fun, yeah

BRENDAN: GIRL POWER! =P

JUSTIN: That’s called gender equality, son. Equality.

BRENDAN: Exactly, women can fight back. Therefore, it makes them equal to men. =P

JUSTIN: That’s not ‘girl power’, though =P

BRENDAN: I use the phrase girl power for it is amsuing. And it empowers the females whom are oppressed even though they make up 51% of the population.

JUSTIN: Oppressed women? Where?

SCARAMOUCHE: [please correct your typos. it makes your argument SO much stronger when you spell things right]

JUSTIN: (what typos?_

JUSTIN: (besides that_

JUSTIN: (son of a fuck)

SCARAMOUCHE: [not you]

BRENDAN: In our society? The whole “lesbian” thing, the fact that women get paid less than men STILL. And I’m on Windows Messenger. There is no spell check 🙂

SCARAMOUCHE: You have eyes, don’t you?

JUSTIN: Uhm, women get paid equal to men

BRENDAN: ^^ My spelling is far from perfect.

BRENDAN: Not true ^^ *points at mom*

JUSTIN: Does your mom work overtime?

BRENDAN: No, she’s a teacher. =P

JUSTIN: All those statistics women pull out to say ‘WE ARE PAID LESS’ in order to justify the oppression of men in this modern age fail to make a distinction between men paying overtime and women who don’t

JUSTIN: Men apparently work overtime to get away from their wives or something, that hasn’t yet been researched

BRENDAN: There are actual studies that have shown that women get paid less. Like, they work the same number of hours, but get less. For example, you get $10.00 an hour as a man. A woman is paid $8.50

JUSTIN: All right, show me.

JUSTIN: I have seen much more evidence to the EXACT contrary.

BRENDAN: I don’t have that stuff on me. o_o; I wish I had it though.

BRENDAN: I’m writing an essay at the same time 🙂

JUSTIN: Well, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

JUSTIN: But just to be sporting, I’ll check

BRENDAN: I’m busy writing. Body paragraph 2. =P

BRENDAN: Due tomorrow for the exam 🙂

JUSTIN: I found one study where women were paid slightly less

JUSTIN: From when? 1996.

JUSTIN: That’s all I’ve found and I’m positive progress was made in 10 years.

JUSTIN: AND, these studies do NOT make distinctions for hours worked, overtime, etc.

JUSTIN: Just how much was earned. That’s it.

BRENDAN: Yes, progress has been made… There is considerably less discrimination. It’s found more in the country/in other countries. But at the same time, women have become more apathetic. Where were the times of women protestors? They’re mostly not around. =P

JUSTIN: The smart women have looked up and said ‘Hey, we’re equal in society, so we should just call it quits then, lest we look like raging cunts!’

JUSTIN: The raging cunts, however, continue to preach ‘girl power’, just like you’re doing.

BRENDAN: And that’s actually what I’m going to be taking in University. 🙂

BRENDAN: And what about women in other countries?

JUSTIN: What about them? Muslim women, you mean? That’s ‘holy’ to them.

JUSTIN: You’re not suggesting we infringe on what these people consider holy, do you?!

BRENDAN: No, I meant like in third world countries. I respect hijabs.

JUSTIN: What about third world countries? You’re not more concerned about several children starving to death every minute or so over there?

BRENDAN: There is much to be concerned about. We each do our part.

JUSTIN: It’s called the heirarchy of human needs. Food, water, shelter and hygiene are first and foremorst. Once those are taken care of, only then can people move on to other needs.

BRENDAN: Safety too?

JUSTIN: Yeah, that

BRENDAN: Women aren’t safe in third world countries ^^

JUSTIN: But when the choice comes down to getting food, or NOT getting food…

JUSTIN: Okay, congratulations, you just rendered your own point null and void.

JUSTIN: You can’t be a feminist when you’re dying of starvation, especially if your only possible source of food is the one oppressing you.

JUSTIN: Hell, I’d swallow my pride and take some male oppression if it meant getting a decent meal once and a while

SCARAMOUCHE: Game, Set, Match: Justin.

JUSTIN: Sweet, where’s my shiny yet impractical belt?

SCARAMOUCHE: It’s in the mail.

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